Legislature(1995 - 1996)

02/06/1995 08:08 AM House RES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
               HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                              
                        February 6, 1995                                       
                           8:08 a.m.                                           
                                                                               
                                                                               
 MEMBERS PRESENT                                                               
                                                                               
 Representative Joe Green, Co-Chairman                                         
 Representative Bill Williams, Co-Chairman                                     
 Representative Scott Ogan, Vice Chairman                                      
 Representative Alan Austerman                                                 
 Representative Pete Kott                                                      
                                                                               
 MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                
                                                                               
 Representative Ramona Barnes                                                  
 Representative John Davies                                                    
 Representative Eileen MacLean                                                 
 Representative Irene Nicholia                                                 
                                                                               
 COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                            
                                                                               
 HB 121"An Act relating to the timber resources within the                    
 state."                                                                       
                                                                               
 PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                     
                                                                               
 HB 113"An Act relating to reports by fishing vessels that are                
 not registered under the laws of the state."                                  
                                                                               
 PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                     
                                                                               
 WITNESS REGISTER                                                              
                                                                               
 SARA HANNAN, Executive Director                                               
 Alaska Environmental Lobby                                                    
 P.O. Box 22151                                                                
 Juneau, AK   99802                                                            
 Phone:  463-3366                                                              
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed HB 121                                           
                                                                               
 JACK PHELPS, Aide                                                             
 Representative Bill Williams                                                  
 State Capitol, Room 128                                                       
 Juneau, AK    99801                                                           
 Phone:  465-3424                                                              
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Prime Sponsor HB 121                                     
                                                                               
 PETER ECKLUND, Aide                                                           
 Representative Bill Williams                                                  
 State Capitol, Room 128                                                       
 Juneau, AK   99801                                                            
 Phone:  465-3424                                                              
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Prime Sponsor HB 113                                     
                                                                               
 GERON BRUCE, Representative                                                   
 Alaska Department of Fish and Game                                            
 P.O. Box 25526                                                                
 Juneau, AK   99811                                                            
 Phone:  465-4100                                                              
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported HB 113 and answered questions                  
                                                                               
 PREVIOUS ACTION                                                               
                                                                              
 BILL:  HB 121                                                                
 SHORT TITLE: SALVAGE TIMBER SALES                                             
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) WILLIAMS, Therriault, Ogan,                     
 Grussendorf, Toohey, Mulder, Rokeberg, Kelly, Kott, Green, G.Davis,           
 Foster, Kohring                                                               
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE    JRN-PG                ACTION                                      
 01/25/95       132    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 01/25/95       132    (H)   RES                                               
 01/26/95       148    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): KELLY, KOTT                         
 01/30/95       180    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): GREEN, G.DAVIS, FOSTER              
 02/03/95              (H)   RES AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 124                       
 02/03/95       242    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): KOHRING                             
 02/06/95              (H)   RES AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 124                       
                                                                              
 BILL:  HB 113                                                                
 SHORT TITLE: REPORTS BY OUT OF STATE FISHING VESSELS                          
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) WILLIAMS,Grussendorf,Kubina,Mackie              
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE    JRN-PG                ACTION                                      
 01/23/95       116    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 01/23/95       117    (H)   FSH, RES                                          
 01/25/95       136    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): KUBINA                              
 01/26/95       148    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): MACKIE                              
 01/30/95       179    (H)   FSH WAIVED PUBLIC HEARING NOTICE,                 
                             RULE 23                                           
 02/01/95              (H)   FSH AT 05:00 PM CAPITOL 124                       
 02/03/95              (H)   RES AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 124                       
 02/03/95       231    (H)   FSH RPT  4DP 1NR                                  
 02/03/95       231    (H)   DP: G.DAVIS, MOSES, ELTON, OGAN                   
 02/03/95       231    (H)   NR: AUSTERMAN                                     
 02/03/95       232    (H)   -ZERO FISCAL NOTE (F&G) 2/3/95                    
 02/06/95              (H)   RES AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 124                       
                                                                               
                                                                               
 ACTION NARRATIVE                                                              
                                                                               
 TAPE 95-10, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 000                                                                    
                                                                               
 The House Resources Committee was called to order by Co-Chairman              
 Williams at 8:08 a.m.  Members present at the call to order were              
 Representatives Williams, Green, Ogan, Austerman and Kott.                    
 Members absent were Representatives Barnes, Davies, MacLean and               
 Nicholia.                                                                     
 HRES - 02/06/95                                                               
 HB 121 - SALVAGE TIMBER SALES                                               
                                                                               
 SARA HANNAN, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ALASKA ENVIRONMENTAL LOBBY, stated           
 she is a property owner in Cooper Landing and over the past 30                
 years has seen the devastation the spruce bark beetle brings to               
 forests.  As a property owner, she has concerns about fire and                
 timber damage and how the Department of Natural Resources (DNR) has           
 managed the dying timber in Southcentral Alaska.                              
                                                                               
 MS. HANNAN stressed there are two things HB 121 does not do which             
 it needs to do.  She stated HB 121 needs to address salvage timber            
 that is dead or dying trees.  She noted the intention of HB 121 is            
 to address the dead and dying timber in Southcentral and Northern             
 Alaska but HB 121 does not limit it to that.  HB 121, as written,             
 opens up any negotiated sale to 25 years.  She pointed out if the             
 state waits 25 years to address the beetle problem in Southcentral            
 Alaska, the next cycle of beetle kill will have already begun.                
 Beetles are not brought on by current suppression techniques but              
 rather are brought on as a natural cycle in a normal forest of                
 uniform age.  She added the spruce bark beetle thrives in a forest            
 that has a uniform age and the beetle corridor follows the road               
 corridor, which is an area which was harvested approximately seven            
 years ago.                                                                    
                                                                               
 MS. HANNAN said it is important now to address what the ongoing               
 problem is from a legislative perspective.  She stated she was                
 outraged to hear DNR say it does have a tool to manage harvesting             
 if the harvesting could happen within 366 days but there was not a            
 tool available if the harvest was going to take 367 days, and that            
 a five year sale is too long to negotiate, and a one year sale is             
 too short.  She felt it was an outrageous problem but is not a                
 statutory problem.  She said the current management available to              
 DNR allows for them, the regional managers, the borough, and                  
 private land owners to negotiate sales to harvest spruce bark                 
 beetle kill, fire threatened timber anywhere in the state which               
 needs harvesting.                                                             
                                                                               
 MS. HANNAN noted the morning's Anchorage Daily News talked about              
 habitat concerns on the Kenai.  She said the area wildlife                    
 biologist for the Alaska Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G) said             
 the current timber sale harvest rates on the Kenai Peninsula are              
 going to, in the next couple of years, provide a crisis in habitat            
 management for big game.  She wondered if a situation is going to             
 be created where the bear corridor is going to be driven back into            
 the resident population because the only trees left standing are              
 those on private property.  She urged committee members to look               
 cautiously at the future of a complicated ecosystem and not to                
 respond to people's concerns when a timber company has not been               
 able to negotiate a timber sale they desire.  She pointed out there           
 are a lot of timber harvesters who are currently cutting trees on             
 Southcentral Peninsula where the beetle infestation is the biggest.           
 She stressed it is not necessary for a statutory change to                    
 accomplish the intent of HB 121 which is to salvage dead and dying            
 trees.                                                                        
                                                                               
 Number 068                                                                    
                                                                               
 JACK PHELPS, AIDE, REPRESENTATIVE BILL WILLIAMS, PRIME SPONSOR,               
 stated HB 121 addresses a problem in the state and specifically               
 allows the state to begin the public process of examining timber              
 sales, under the circumstances described, more quickly than it                
 currently can.  Currently, the state is required to list those                
 timber sales in two five-year schedules, meaning there is a minimum           
 of 24 months of scheduling before the sales can begin.  He felt it            
 was important for the committee to note that HB 121 does not set              
 aside any of the requirements of the Forest Practices Act (FPA) in            
 terms of how the timber is harvested.  He said it was also                    
 important for the committee to note that HB 121 does not set aside            
 any public comments.  He pointed out that HB 121 does require a               
 time for both agency and municipal comment, as well as public                 
 comment before the state goes forward.                                        
                                                                               
 MR. PHELPS explained the second section of HB 121 adds an                     
 additional element to those situations in which the state can                 
 negotiate a sale.  He noted that these negotiated sales are                   
 currently in statute and require all three of the elements listed             
 on page 2, lines 2-4, before a salvage sale can go forward.  He               
 stated what HB 121 adds to that requirement is the timber which is            
 being referred to as salvageable.  He pointed out the provisions of           
 HB 121 are in harmony with current regulations that indicate when             
 there is timber endangered by insects or disease epidemics, it                
 should be harvested quickly                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KOTT stated based on testimony he heard, there            
 are a lot of positives to be gained by HB 121.                                
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT made a MOTION to MOVE HB 121 out of committee             
 with individual recommendations.                                              
                                                                               
 CO-CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS asked if there were any objections.  Hearing             
 none, the MOTION PASSED.                                                      
 HRES - 02/06/95                                                               
 Number 121                                                                    
                                                                               
 HB 113 - REPORTS BY OUT OF STATE FISHING VESSELS                            
                                                                               
 PETER ECKLUND, AIDE, REPRESENTATIVE BILL WILLIAMS, PRIME SPONSOR,             
 stated HB 113 will give the Board of Fish the authority to adopt              
 regulations concerning foreign fishing vessels transiting or in               
 state waters.  He said HB 113 would allow the board to require                
 foreign fishing vessels to report to the ADF&G the quantity,                  
 species, and origin of fish on board.                                         
                                                                               
                                                                               
 MR. ECKLUND explained HB 113 will assist the ADF&G in their effort            
 to collect data on the state's border fisheries.  HB 113 could                
 provide ADF&G with additional in-season management data, providing            
 the state with some significant and timely information that was               
 previously unavailable to the state's fisheries managers.  He said            
 HB 113 will also help protect the state's interest by deterring               
 potential illegal fishing in the state's waters.  He noted that               
 section two of HB 113 directs the Board of Fish to consider for               
 adoption, before May 1996, the provisions of HB 113 concerning                
 foreign fishing vessels present in or transiting the waters of                
 Southeast Alaska.  He urged the committee to support HB 113.                  
                                                                               
 MR. ECKLUND indicated that when HB 113 was heard in the Fisheries             
 Committee, Representative Ogan asked about a fiscal impact on the             
 Department of Public Safety.  Mr. Ecklund contacted that department           
 and was told verbally that the department would have a zero fiscal            
 note.                                                                         
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOE GREEN wondered, in light of the zero fiscal                
 notes, if there will be a method of getting cooperation from the              
 foreign vessels.                                                              
                                                                               
 MR. ECKLUND responded HB 113 will enable the Board of Fish to set             
 up requirements and regulations regarding Canadian or foreign                 
 fishing vessels reporting origin, species, and quantity on board.             
 He explained there has been a dramatic increase in Canadian                   
 trawlers in the Dixon Entrance, in southern Southeast Alaska.                 
 These trawlers fish during the day, come into Alaska waters and               
 anchor up at night, and then go back to Canadian waters during the            
 day.  He stated ADF&G, the Department of Public Safety and other              
 departments affected will be involved in writing the regulations,             
 if the Board of Fish decides to pursue this area.                             
                                                                               
 Number 172                                                                    
                                                                               
 GERON BRUCE, REPRESENTATIVE, ADF&G, stated ADF&G would be involved            
 in adopting the regulations which HB 113 would enable.  He said               
 most likely, ADF&G would have minimal activity and would probably             
 just set up a record-a-phone and the regulations would require the            
 Canadian or foreign vessels who are coming into the state's waters            
 to anchor, report in and have their catches enumerated on a                   
 recorded message.  He stated in regard to enforcement, ADF&G does             
 have some current activity associated with the state's fisheries in           
 the Dixon Entrance area as does the Department of Public Safety.              
 He explained as resources permitted, they could perform spot checks           
 in the course of their routine operations.                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT OGAN asked if ADF&G supports HB 113.                     
                                                                               
 MR. BRUCE said ADF&G supports HB 113 and would attempt to put a               
 program in place if the Board of Fisheries so directed.                       
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT asked if there were any international                     
 implications with HB 113.                                                     
                                                                               
 MR. BRUCE responded the department is working intensely with the              
 Canadian government within the Pacific Salmon Commission arena,               
 which is the body that implements the Pacific Salmon Treaty.  In              
 addition, George Utermohle, legislative attorney, has prepared a              
 legal opinion on the legality of HB 113 which says as long as the             
 provision is directed at protecting the state's resources, he                 
 believes it would be a legal exercise of state authority.                     
                                                                               
 Number 215                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT asked if the state is already regulating                  
 Canadian vessels from the state's perspective, through another                
 which would give some precedence.                                             
                                                                               
 MR. BRUCE replied in regard to fisheries he did not believe the               
 state is.  He said the area being discussed (Dixon Entrance) is a             
 unique situation which was brought about because the boundary area            
 is disputed and Canadians are fishing closer to Alaska than they              
 are to their own home port.  He stated the state does not allow               
 fishing by foreign vessels in Alaska's waters and therefore are not           
 regulating them.                                                              
                                                                               
 MR. ECKLUND said according to the drafting attorney, as long as the           
 state enacts the legislation primarily to protect the state's                 
 interest by deterring potential illegal fishing in the state's                
 waters, the attorney believes that simply asking Canadian or                  
 foreign fishing vessels to report the amount and species of fish              
 they have on board is not much of a hindrance and is within the               
 state's right.                                                                
                                                                               
 CO-CHAIRMAN GREEN made a MOTION to place HB 113 before the                    
 committee.                                                                    
                                                                               
 CO-CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS asked if there were any objections.  Hearing             
 none, the MOTION PASSED.                                                      
                                                                               
 CO-CHAIRMAN GREEN questioned if HB 113 would impact other areas in            
 the state.                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. ECKLUND replied HB 113 only allows the Board of Fish to set up            
 requirements regionally.  If the board chose to set up requirements           
 for only southern Southeast Alaska, they can do that.  He said                
 HB 113 does not bind the board to set up regulations statewide.               
                                                                               
 Number 267                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT asked if HB 113 passes, what would be the                 
 penalty if a commercial foreign vessel does not report in.                    
                                                                               
 MR. BRUCE replied it would be a misdemeanor under Title 16.                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT felt the penalty should be stiffer.                       
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KOTT made a MOTION to MOVE HB 113 out of committee             
 with individual recommendations.                                              
                                                                               
 CO-CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS asked if there were any objections to the                
 motion.  Hearing none, the MOTION PASSED.                                     
 CO-CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS announced the committee will meet Wednesday,             
 February 8 at 8:00 a.m. to hear HB 102.                                       
                                                                               
 ADJOURNMENT                                                                   
                                                                               
 There being no further business to come before the House Resources            
 Committee, Co-Chairman Williams adjourned the meeting at 8:30 a.m.            
                                                                               

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